She Said, She Said: We’re So Lost, 5×08   

A lot of people seemed to have loved last week’s episode of Lost, “LaFleur.” Jody and I weren’t in that camp but we did like it a lot and, as usual, it left us with some thinky thoughts…

Living in the past seems to agree with Sawyer on LOST.Just Jody: So, while not a mind blowing episode, it sure was fun!

Rae: Yeah, I pretty much agree with you on this although, amusingly, Greg declared it the best of the season last night and I definitely don’t agree with that.

Just Jody: Not really a lot to analyze in that one. I was happy we finally got an answer to the “What were the survivors left on the island doing for the 3 years the Oceanic 6 was back living in the real world?” question. And as far as I can tell, life on the island in the 70′s was much happier than it was back home in present day!

Rae: Haha, yes, it certainly seemed that way! Although I had pretty much figured out “when” they were so I kinda suspected what they were doing for the three years. Nice to get proof of it. Even if I’m still confused about how the time travel rules work. Haven’t they now changed things in the past?

Just Jody: I’m assuming all these things still happened in the past even though they weren’t there, maybe they’ve changed the little things a bit, but the events themselves probably still happened. Just like with Charlie’s death, if it’s meant to happen “the universe has a way of course correcting itself” and what was meant to be will be. And with the baby that was actually born on the island, I don’t think they changed anything, I just think they maybe improved the situation? But the real question is, was the birth successful because whatever caused the birthing problems hasn’t happened yet? (Like Ben’s mass-murder gassing, or perhaps a hydrogen bomb exploding?) Or was this baby conceived off island like Aaron?

At first I thought the fact that the baby was born on the island was the significant detail, and the who was irrelevant. But so many people are speculating as to who the baby is, that now I’ve started to wonder about that too. So far the only plausible theories I’ve read are that it’s Jacob – Horace did build what will become Jacob’s cabin, or that it’s Desmond. I’m leaning more towards Jacob, except that doesn’t fit with the fact that Richard seemed to know who Jacob was back in the 50′s. Of course time travel could be a factor there, or maybe Richard didn’t really know who Jacob was? He didn’t seem to react at all to John saying “Jacob sent me”, so maybe he was just keeping quiet to hide his ignorance? And since we don’t know anything about Desmond’s parents or childhood, and he is about the right age he’s also a possibility. But, I’m quite content to just wait until they tell us that one!

Juliet successfully delivers a baby on the island.Rae: I only wondered about who the baby is because I figured it had to be someone we’ve met. Either through the Dharma flashbacks we’ve had already or because it’s someone we know now. I do think the baby being successfully born is significant as well. Kinda blows my theory out of the water. It’s possible Amy got pregnant off the island, especially since they seem like they can travel back and forth easily enough at this point but wouldn’t Sawyer and Juliet have known that and been less worried about her pregnancy not being successful? Although, by those same standards, you’d think Juliet wouldn’t have been worried about her pregnancy at all since she made it further than all the previous pregnancies on the island.

Anyway, all of that to agree that it does appear that something that happens later is the cause of the pregnancy stuff. Although I wonder if it still has to do with WHO gets pregnant. At this point, all of the pregnancies that we know have failed have been actually be Others. Maybe there’s a reason *they* can’t carry a baby to term on the island?

But on to the who… Desmond and Jacob were my best guesses too. I agree I don’t think we know for sure Richard confirmed anything to Locke and could have just wanted to hear what he had to say more than he was reacting to the name Jacob in the past but I’ve just always gotten the idea that he was older so I dunno. Then again, it does fit with Horace building the cabin in Locke’s dream. (Except it *was* a dream so we can’t rely on it as a fact.) Mona kept trying to convince me it was Daniel but I really doubt it. Unless Ellie steals the boy away from Amy when she leaves the island.

Just Jody: I don’t really think it was just a dream. I’ve been watching a lot of random older episodes, and Locke seemed to have quite a bit of knowledge as to what was going to happen long before we realized what was going on with time on the island. Like how many times did he know it was going to rain? When Desmond was having his time flashes back in S3, he used rain as an example to try and prove to Charlie that he was from the future, and Locke has predicted the rain a number of times. Then there was the time Jack fell off a cliff (when he was chasing his dad through the jungle) and was the one Locke went after him because he “knew where to look”, and then he miraculously found Jack right away. The ‘dream’ that Locke had about Horace led him to real information, and considering the nosebleeds and time loopiness of the encounter, I think it was some form of time travel more than just a dream.

Rae: Hmmm, maybe.

Little Charlotte on LOST?BTW, is it now possible that Charlotte is Annie? I really thought she was younger than Ben but, based on the timeline as we now know it, it seems like she was young enough to be a young girl on the island around the time Ben is there. I don’t quite understand how she would have forgotten as much as she seemed to… but I must admit to not really being able to recall much from that age either. And it’s very possible that her mother changed her name when they fled the island? Just some food for thought.

Just Jody: I still don’t think Charlotte is old enough… if she was 2 or 3 in 1974, she’d only be around 36 (or so) now, and Ben appears quite a bit older than that. Ah, but I just realized that the slow aging on the island could definitely be a factor there… when Charlotte first came to the island, Ben said she was “was born on July 2, 1979 in Essex, England to parents David and Jeannette,” which of course doesn’t fit with the fact that we saw her in 1974.

Onto something less confusing on the brain, we finally saw the four toed statue before it was just a foot! From the back, it seems to be the Egyptian God Anubis. Anubis was the god to protect the dead and bring them to the afterlife. (From Wikipedia) Although I have read comments that it could be the Egyptian God Horus, and while I don’t agree, it is interesting that the hieroglyphic for Horus is the bird symbol that we saw in the hatch counter:

The Egyptian hieroglyphics seen on the counter in the hatch on LOST.

Rae: Brain twin! I sent the Anubis info out to my Lost buddies from last night because we were arguing about the statue and it seems to fit the best. Especially since Paul had an ankh necklace. I don’t think it’s Horus, it seemed to the ears like Anubis. But I don’t think it’s a coincidence that we have a character named Horace who we see in the same episode that we get a glimpse of the statue that definitely looks Egyptian and one of the Dharma people is wearing an ankh. Especially when, as you pointed out, we’ve seen Egyptian symbols used in the Dharma stations.

Sawyer and Juliet kiss on LOST.Just Jody: And it seems one of my least favourite parts of the episode is everyone else’s favourite. Always the way. Sawyer and Juliet. Love them both. LOTS. But together as a couple? Ick! They have NO chemistry. That kiss was awful. Especially compared with the Skate kisses we’ve seen. Except that (as you know) I’m a big Jack/Kate shipper, so really I should want Sawyer with Juliet right?

Rae: HAHA. It wasn’t my favorite part of the episode! The pairing does nothing for me but I have to admit that it’s almost entirely because I prefer Jack and Juliet. Ha. No matter who ends up together, one of us is going to be unhappy. I didn’t see any chemistry either but wasn’t sure if it was those thoughts blinding me. I also felt like it didn’t seem so much like they were really in love with each other so much as they were in love with the idea that they’d found some peace and happiness. Plus, it’s not like it’s enjoyable when you know the Jack and Kate are going to appear by the end of the episode.

Just Jody: Some big questions that won’t leave my brain: Where were Miles and Daniel in the 3 years later scenes? Because I’m still of the belief that Miles is Candle/Chang’s son and if that’s true, then he’d have to be running into his dad around Dharma Town…

Rae: Uh, wasn’t Miles driving around with Sawyer at some point in those scenes? I could have sworn they had a conversation in the car together. Maybe when Sawyer went off to get Juliet? But I agree, it does seem like he’s going to meet Candle. Especially since we know Daniel is around when they’re building the Orchid.

Just Jody: Yes right, we did see Miles with Sawyer when they went to get drunk Horace. Forgot about that!

The painting seen in Ben's house on LOST.Ok, another question: How are the survivors handling young Ben back in the 70′s?? According to what we know, he should be on the island as a young boy about then. And could that mean that the woman in the painting in Ben’s house is actually Juliet? (Personally, I’ve always thought it was his mom.)

Rae: I’ll start by saying the whole Horace/Olivia/Amy thing confuses me but it seems as though when we met Horace previously, it was later than it is now. Which means that Ben may not be there yet. He comes to the island when he’s 10 so he doesn’t have to be there… but one would think he’s going to be there soon. Again, the time travel stuff confuses me because wouldn’t Ben remember all of these guys from when he met them as a child???

Just Jody: Well, everyone seems to be assuming Olivia was Horace’s wife, but she could’ve been a relative and that would explain them having the same last name. OR perhaps she dies giving birth the first time without Juliet there, and leaves Horace a widow? A young Ben arrives on the island on LOST.We know Ben was born in the early 60′s, and I’d have to say he’s more like 13ish when he comes to the island…. he seems older than 10 I think? So perhaps you’re right, and we’re going to see his arrival in the very near future. Horace did look pretty much the same in this episode as he did when he greeted Ben and his dad off the sub.

Rae: To be honest, I’m basing my comments about Ben’s age on what I read on Lostpedia. So it’s possible you’re right and I’m wrong. But I do think it’s possible that he’s not there yet and everything we’re seeing at this point is from before Ben gets to the Island.

Just Jody: Ha. No, I think you are right.

And, finally, my biggest question: WHERE are Sun and Sayid?

Rae: At first I wasn’t completely convinced that Sun and Sayid are in the same time. Now, however, I think they are. Mostly because the only reason I didn’t buy it before was because Locke wasn’t in the past. BUT, in this episode we see that once Charlotte died, she didn’t flash with the others anymore. I think that’s why Locke stays with the Ajira plane crew and not with the O6. That said, we just caught up with Jack, Hurley, and Kate at the end of the episode so I don’t think we’ve had time to find out where they are… It is weird that Jack, Kate, and Hurley wouldn’t insist on looking for them once they reunite with Jin but maybe he convinces them there isn’t time? Or that they can do that after they meet up with Sawyer? Because I have a sneaking suspicion one or both of them (Sun and Sayid) may have had a run in with the Others. I suspect they’re going to draw out the Jin/Sun reunion a little longer so that seems the easiest way to do that. It doesn’t look like the Dharma folks and the Others are exactly communicating so it’s not like they’d be rushing to tell them they found someone on the island. I figured that was why Sawyer had his guys doing constant sweeps for Locke and the others, they didn’t want them to be found by the Others first.

Just Jody: Also, supporting this theory is the possibility that Rose disappeared when the first time flash happened, but Bernard didn’t. I hope we get to see the actual reunion between Jin and Jack, Hurley and Kate. I’d LOVE to see how that went… I think mostly because it’s the emotional moments that I enjoy the most. Just like the reunion with Sawyer and Jin, I assume this one would have been emotionally charged as well. And then we’d have some idea as to what they said about Sun as well.

Rae: Wait, what? Rose disappeared when the first time flash happened but Bernard didn’t? I’m confused. I thought Rose and Bernard were last seen together?? That is one of my big questions at the moment. Where the heck are those two and Vincent? Also, why would her disappearing support the theory? Are you saying she was dead?

Just Jody: Right after the very first time flash, Rose and Bernard were running around yelling for each other, and she came out of the jungle saying she was over by the church. They way they were so much more freaked out than everyone else, I took it that she had disappeared on him. If my theory about some of them having died in the original crash is true, I would put Rose as one of the reincarnated because her cancer was healed. There’s no solid evidence on any of this, it’s just something that I’ve been wondering about since the season premiere.

Rae: Oh. I actually thought it was just that during that initial flash they weren’t standing together and the flash freaked them out, especially since they lost each other when the plane crashed. I didn’t think it meant Rose wasn’t there. Plus I’m not sure why she’d reappear? I guess we’ll find out later on that one… or we better!

And, umm yeah, I don’t think I have anything else to add. That pretty much covers it all. I had some of the same questions as you about their being in the past and interacting with people who they know in the future (or their past selves). I also wonder if we’re going to see Ellie and Widmore again. Or their island selves, I should say. I’m pretty sure Widmore should still be on the island at this point since it is Ben who tricks him into leaving. We were trying to figure out what that meant about Penny last night and I’m still not sure. It’s not like Ben is going to trick him into leaving at the age of 10 so does that mean Penny was born on the island too?

Just Jody: Good point about Widmore! I was assuming he’d be long gone, but of course if Ben tricked him into leaving it’ll still be a while until he goes.

I can’t believe we have to wait 2 weeks until we get a new episode! I thought Lost was supposed to be repeat free??

Rae: I don’t know why they ended up having this one off-week in here but I do know it’s supposed to be new all the way through the end from that point. Good thing because I hate not having a new Lost to look forward to! Guess we’ll just have to spend the next two weeks speculating on the statue…

We finally get a glimpse at the four-toed statue from season two of LOST.

One Response to “She Said, She Said: We’re So Lost, 5×08”

  1. 1
    Stella says:

    1. I think the pregnancy problems happened later. Remember we’re in the age of the Dharma Initiative and the problems were occurring with The Others.

    2. Ben is about 11-12 at this point in time and is due to arrive on the island with his Dad any moment now. In fact, young Ben is listed in the credits for the next episode of LOST…

    3. I initially thought the little red-headed girl Daniel saw was Charlotte–but doing the math I realize that can’t be right. Her older sister maybe?

    4. Great point about Miles and Dr. Chang! Wow–it makes my head hurt trying to untangle that one…